Removing DRM could decrease piracy say people who study these things

Well with me if it is a game that I really enjoy I will buy the original, if it is a game that I am not too keen on then I won't get it at all. But if that game does have always online requirement (diablo 3 I am looking at you) I will try and get the pirated version as well. There is no reason why somebody shouldn't buy the original just because of the online requirement. You can always use the pirated version to play and keep original version in mint condition (if retail). That way you can always play and still support the developer

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Originally Posted by simon

Well with me if it is a game that I really enjoy I will buy the original, if it is a game that I am not too keen on then I won't get it at all. But if that game does have always online requirement (diablo 3 I am looking at you) I will try and get the pirated version as well. There is no reason why somebody shouldn't buy the original just because of the online requirement. You can always use the pirated version to play and keep original version in mint condition (if retail). That way you can always play and still support the developer

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On the great ethical plane of morality I'd rather abstain from even bothering to play the game.

If you buy it, you in effect support that DRM scheme by allowing studies/developers/whatever to think that somehow it "works" when it actually doesn't.

If you pirate it, you in effect support DRM by allowing studies/developer/whatever to think that somehow DRM isn't "effective" enough.

If, however, you neither buy nor pirate the worthless piece of trash, you can comfortably point out that the DRM was the driving force behind that decision. Unfortunately, nine times out of ten piracy gets blamed then anyway or touted as a success :rolleyes:

In an ideal world developers would listen to the people who buy their games first and foremost and ignore the rest. Essentially then, if the people who buy their games say, "Look, that DRM thing you're so fond of? Yeah, it doesn't work and if you don't remove it from your most recent game and keep it out of your future games, I will no longer support you" they'd listen. Unfortunately, they kind of don't.

Really though, I'm not against piracy: I've said countless times before that it contributed to my love of gaming and that in the past, through piracy, I discovered a number of games I would never have even bothered looking at had I not originally pirated them. Games I have since bought a number of times over for friends, my significant other and have pre-ordered sequels of.

However, piracy was something I did, for the most part, as a broke kid. However, I still understand that there are people who couldn't be arsed to buy media and the fact remains that those are people who would never buy media in the first place. They are not a target market, they are not the people publishers/developers/etc are supposed to appeal to or try to turn into buyers. Doing that is a failed ideology akin to shooting yourself in the foot.

Well let's put it this way. Risen 2, which I know you are interested in will be making use of Steam. While Steam is better then always on methods such as Ubisoft's shitty DRM, it still is a somewhat intrusive form of DRM.
I love Piranha Bytes and will buy this game because I loved Risen 1 and all the Gothic's, in fact they are all in my top 5 games, but if I uninstall the game and need to then download it to get it back on my computer (not too sure on Steam doings as the only game I have using Steam at the moment is Darksiders) then yes I will get a pirate version as well because my internet comes from the abyss of hellkom.
Now for a game that you are really looking forward to, would you really not buy it or play it just because of the DRM inconvenience. Let's face it, the developers will probably never stop using there DRM for quite a long time at least, but if you don't play/buy the game because of it you will miss out on so many gems in the first place.
I only found out about Gothic because of a pirated copy and bought the first original copy I saw, because I loved it so dearly, so yeah I also agree that piracy can be a good thing

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Originally Posted by simon

Well let's put it this way. Risen 2, which I know you are interested in will be making use of Steam. While Steam is better then always on methods such as Ubisoft's shitty DRM, it still is a somewhat intrusive form of DRM.
I love Piranha Bytes and will buy this game because I loved Risen 1 and all the Gothic's, in fact they are all in my top 5 games, but if I uninstall the game and need to then download it to get it back on my computer (not too sure on Steam doings as the only game I have using Steam at the moment is Darksiders) then yes I will get a pirate version as well because my internet comes from the abyss of hellkom.
Now for a game that you are really looking forward to, would you really not buy it or play it just because of the DRM inconvenience. Let's face it, the developers will probably never stop using there DRM for quite a long time at least, but if you don't play/buy the game because of it you will miss out on so many gems in the first place.
I only found out about Gothic because of a pirated copy and bought the first original copy I saw, because I loved it so dearly, so yeah I also agree that piracy can be a good thing

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Dude, not to be rude, but it is Digital Distribution. So if you do delete it, you will need to re download it. Unless you back it up.

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but if I uninstall the game and need to then download it to get it back on my computer (not too sure on Steam doings as the only game I have using Steam at the moment is Darksiders) then yes I will get a pirate version as well because my internet comes from the abyss of hellkom.

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Right click -> Create backup -> burn to DVD

... 10seconds worth of googling would have gotten you your solution.

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Now for a game that you are really looking forward to, would you really not buy it or play it just because of the DRM inconvenience.

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Yes there have been quite a few games that I would have bought but didn't because of the stupid DRM. Settlers 7 was one that was already mentioned, Assassin's Creed 2 on release and a few others I don't recall since they just became non-entities to me. On REALLY big releases that you just must have well then you bite the DRM bullet since you figure the pain is worth the reward but the problem is that only applies to very few titles and most of the fringe titles that 'you probably would have bought' just don't warrant you having to deal with DRM so those get a skip.

I'm with Lyc in that if it's not worth buying it's not worth playing.

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Let's face it, the developers will probably never stop using there DRM for quite a long time at least, but if you don't play/buy the game because of it you will miss out on so many gems in the first place.

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Actually they do remove the DRM, like Assassin's Creed 2 which I bought a year after release when the DRM was gone. Other games that have had their DRM removed weeks/months after release include Bioshock, Mass Effect, Spore, From Dust and numerous others.

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Originally Posted by simon

Well let's put it this way. Risen 2, which I know you are interested in will be making use of Steam. While Steam is better then always on methods such as Ubisoft's shitty DRM, it still is a somewhat intrusive form of DRM.
I love Piranha Bytes and will buy this game because I loved Risen 1 and all the Gothic's, in fact they are all in my top 5 games, but if I uninstall the game and need to then download it to get it back on my computer (not too sure on Steam doings as the only game I have using Steam at the moment is Darksiders) then yes I will get a pirate version as well because my internet comes from the abyss of hellkom.
Now for a game that you are really looking forward to, would you really not buy it or play it just because of the DRM inconvenience. Let's face it, the developers will probably never stop using there DRM for quite a long time at least, but if you don't play/buy the game because of it you will miss out on so many gems in the first place.
I only found out about Gothic because of a pirated copy and bought the first original copy I saw, because I loved it so dearly, so yeah I also agree that piracy can be a good thing

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I have no problem with Steam. It works, your games are always readily-available, it keeps games updated, there is no need for other third-party (actually intrusive) DRM like rootkits, activation limits, etc and it's entirely possible to play offline. Steamworks games also have achievements which, while not everyone's cup of tea, makes for some added replayability just to see or do things you would otherwise not have.

Put it this way: I own physical copies of a number of my games, including the Gothic series (minus the shitty ones of which I will not speak), I've basically bought them all over again on Steam. My original retail copies are kept safe and I have a digital version which works as well as you'd expect.

Steam isn't perfect, of course. It has its disadvantages too such as resale, specifically. But that's not an issue for someone like me who will never sell his games anyway.

If I had to choose between a Steamworks game and a Securom/Ubisoft-DRM game it would be an easy choice.

Hell, the only reason I haven't bought Risen again on Steam is because it has Tages of all bloody things as well. As much as I love the game, I won't support a game using DRM of that nature.

I'm also bloody sick of Games for Windows Live.

Also, regarding your uninstalling of Steam games... Yeah, I have a separate 1TB drive dedicated to Steam :p

I don't uninstall Steam games :D

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Originally Posted by MOnk

Actually they do remove the DRM, like Assassin's Creed 2 which I bought a year after release when the DRM was gone.

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You've just hit a point I've been wondering about for a while: Assassin's Creed 2 and Brotherhood don't have DRM any more?

Been eyeballing them for a while but really don't want to put money towards them otherwise.

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Originally Posted by Lycanthrope

You've just hit a point I've been wondering about for a while: Assassin's Creed 2 and Brotherhood don't have DRM any more?

Been eyeballing them for a while but really don't want to put money towards them otherwise.

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They removed the always-on DRM from AC2 and never had it in ACB.

*not 100% sure if you still need to be online to start the game with the UbiLauncher, didn't actually pay attention to that.

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Originally Posted by MOnk

They removed the always-on DRM from AC2 and never had it in ACB.

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Really? I'm impressed!

How does it work in AC2 now? Actually, how does it work in either?

There's really just nothing now?

That's excellent news :3

But then what the hell were they thinking with From Dust? O.o'

I was sure there were more gamer scientists, cos they would have known this already and have saved some money.
with which they could buy more games.