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Metacritcs best games of 2009: http://features.metacritic.com/featu...games-of-2009/ PC does not feature in the top 10 even though some of the games were multiplatform releases.Quote:
Originally Posted by Azimuth
VGChartz: http://www.vgchartz.com/chartsindex.php No PC games featured anywhere.
not to forget all the zomg other things like for example god of war or gears of war...Quote:
Originally Posted by Azimuth
larch, plain and simply, I never said that PC gamers are hardcore and that you will never find a hardcore console gamer. I said quite the contrary.
I don't understand why console players state that PC's are so much more expensive. I bought my PC 2 years ago for just above R5500 (2.2GHz Core 2 Duo, 4gig ram, 750GB HD, 1333Hz motherboard, Geforce 9600GT 512mb). At that time it was close to the same price as the consoles, with one big difference: My PC's fps and multi-functionality kicks a console's ass! PC do so much more than consoles, media players, storage and still out preform any console.
Noted, I did assemble my PC myself. But a well maintained PC crashes and bugs a lot less than consoles(at least in comparison with people I know).
Finally, it doesn't make sense that are seen as easier to produce. All console games are still developed on a PC.
wow i feel enlightenment :)
console + lcd == pricy. then again it should be around the 10k mark for both. same for a decent mid level pc. both of my mid ranges was 9-12k. however as we all know the upgrade cycle is a bitch on a pc. not like you buy each 6 - 8 months a new lcd for your console... do you ?
Console games dont get developed on PC`s they get developed on console DEV KITS.Quote:
Originally Posted by Sidius
wow I always thought they where developed on PCsQuote:
Originally Posted by larch
http://dundee.cs.queensu.ca/wiki/ind...me_Development
http://www.theinquirer.net/inquirer/...-kits-explored
http://news.teamxbox.com/xbox/8096/X...t-Kit-Spotted/
http://www.xbox365.com/news.cgi?id=GGudiGrLdi07062240
LOL. A devkit is a software package. An Xbox devkit, for example, is a collection of libraries, compilers, and whatnot. It's often integrated with Visual Studio. Sure, you get special debug consoles for running dev code (since Xbox code is obviously compiled for Xbox, not PC), but console games are developed (coded) on PCs.Quote:
Originally Posted by larch
I literally loled.
I stand corrected then my mistake you learn something new each day.Quote:
Originally Posted by Azimuth
I'm writing this via my XBox MS Office Dev Kit since I shorted out my PC after spewing my coffee all over it from reading Larch's statement. :pQuote:
Originally Posted by Azimuth
At best, pc gaming is in for a reboot. It will never die, there are too many people who own a PC, and where there is a PC there is a market.
Even if it does die, the number of games already on the platform is enough to keep me entertained till I grow old.
for example: I still sometimes play diablo 2 which is 14 years old, HOMM 3 - 11 years, C&C Generals - 7, Dungeon Keeper - 13
larch, you don't seem to comprehend what Vixe is telling you.Quote:
Originally Posted by larch
to reply to your post, what your saying is something that's more a case of metacritic putting a certain game in its "top rated" section where it was a multi platform release and showing the console version. Even if the PC version is vastly superior to the console version they tend to have the console box on the "best rated" sections. i'm not a regular at metacritic but i take it they're doing what gamespot always does.
i'm not here to rip off consoles or console owners, i simply speak fact... having access to two consoles and a gaming PC i can tell you now that in most cases the PC version of a game will look, feel and play better on a PC compared to a console. It's just the way it is. Your reference to the charts does not prove that consoles can be compared to a new gaming PC.
You mentioned Bioshock 2 earlier ... try playing it on a gaming PC using a mouse and your keyboad. Then try and play it on a console... the entire experience will be different.
Vixe tried to explain to you how different PC gamers are to console gamers and its true. we're willing to spend alot of money on keeping our PC's up to date but we demand top notch gaming. half of the dribble available for consoles would never make it on the PC platform because they're just absolute crap.
there's no microsoft or sony to look after the PC because they don't make any money off the game sales.
i'll sum my post up by asking you this... a game like mass effect 2, i paid R350 for it while you'd have to pay close to double that for the same game. only difference is that the PC version is FAR superior in terms of graphics, gameplay and experience. The only difference is that your paying double cause microsoft and sony need to make their cut. now are you still surprised that the xbox and ps3 get more exclusives?
Metacritic maintains entirely separate listings for each platform. So something like Modern Warfare 2, for example, has three separate entries as a PC, Xbox, and PS3 title. The scores do vary between them.Quote:
Originally Posted by Cloudster
Come on, this isn't true at all. There's plenty of shit available on PC. Check that budget title display at Checkers next time.Quote:
Vixe tried to explain to you how different PC gamers are to console gamers and its true. we're willing to spend alot of money on keeping our PC's up to date but we demand top notch gaming. half of the dribble available for consoles would never make it on the PC platform because they're just absolute crap.
Yeah, because Microsoft doesn't make any money from Windows. :PQuote:
there's no microsoft or sony to look after the PC because they don't make any money off the game sales.
Sure, Mass Effect looks better (actually, much better) on PC. But gameplay and experience? That's very subjective. After almost decades as an exclusive PC gamer, I got myself an Xbox three years ago. Now I play almost everything on console instead. Why? I just prefer the feel of a gamepad. I also prefer playing in a nice recliner with my feet up. That's a big deal for me. And I'm old skool - graphics are kinda secondary to my maximising the rest of the experience. Experience over graphics for me. :)Quote:
i'll sum my post up by asking you this... a game like mass effect 2, i paid R350 for it while you'd have to pay close to double that for the same game. only difference is that the PC version is FAR superior in terms of graphics, gameplay and experience. The only difference is that your paying double cause microsoft and sony need to make their cut. now are you still surprised that the xbox and ps3 get more exclusives?
Incidentally, I still play the occasional game of Team Fortress 2 on PC, and it feels all wrong now, haha.
Also, Mass Effect 2 was R530 new. That's not really "almost double". It's also not much extra to pay considering there's no DRM and massive patches to worry about (Xbox game patches rarely exceed 5-10 MB).
Anyway, just be careful about making definitive statements about subjective things like "experience". For everyone who prefers gaming on PC, great. For everyone who prefers gaming on console, great. And they all lived happily ever after.
Damn that was fast I was still typing my one finger reply then I saw this and gave up :/Quote:
Originally Posted by Azimuth
pc's are for lamers who need a keyboard and mouse to phew phew phew and don't have the skill to learn the hardcore method of using a gamepad effectively.
lol, that's like saying the invention of the lightbulb was lame because it's more difficult to start a fire with flint and use that as a source of light as opposed to flicking a switch.Quote:
Originally Posted by Necuno
..... lol
Edit:
back onto why consoles suck... do you not find the idea of a piece of hardware which is supposed to be the cutting edge of gaming technology having a 10 year life span (they hope) a bit silly?
this is why so many PC gamers say that consoles are in fact what is keeping all gaming behind in general. the PC will outlive the PS3 and Xbox360 and their successors. it's only a matter of time till they stop making consoles the way they have been up until now (not i did not say they will stop making them altogether, i am saying that releasing something and expecting it to sell for 10 years is very unprogressive and that's one thing the gaming industry should not be about)
exactly. no tears for the weak. http://mybroadband.co.za/vb/images/smilies/twisted.pngQuote:
Originally Posted by Cloudster
...Oh. Excuse me, I must've mistaken you for someone worth discussing anything with.Quote:
Originally Posted by Cloudster
I'll leave you with this - game development came a long, long way in the 90s. You know why? Relatively static hardware standards meant developers had time to make the most out of what they had, and maximise the potential of available hardware. Compare an Xbox 360 launch title with something like Mass Effect 2 or even Gears of War 2, and maybe you'll realise what an advantage it is to not have to work around different hardware and driver iterations every two weeks.
I miss the days when all I needed to be happy was a Nintendo Game Boy and a Pokemon RPG. :( Everybody's so angry nowadays about who and what's best. It's all subjective and relative. It's just everybody's own opinion.
I have a Pokemon RPG on my DS. It's a guilty pleasure. :3
I cry because I can't afford batteries :<
I think he means from the console license fees :pQuote:
Originally Posted by Azimuth
Shes a journalist ;)Quote:
Originally Posted by larch
I know. I was pointing out that Microsoft has a vested interest in PC gaming too. ;) I daresay a fair percentage of early Windows 7 adopters are gamers. DX10 without Vista? Yes, please.Quote:
Originally Posted by tpex
It's DX11 now - comes standard with Windows 7 ;)Quote:
Originally Posted by Azimuth
Quote:
Originally Posted by Necuno
Statements like this just don't help at all. Agree to disagree, seriously. It's a matter of personal preference in the end. I prefer PC over consoles, not because I believe consoles suck, but because I - the exact opposoite of Azimuth, who likes the feel of the gamepad - prefer using a keyboard and mouse.Quote:
Originally Posted by Cloudster
At the same time, there are games I prefer playing on consoles - fighting and racing games for instance. But FPS and MMORPGs will always be PC territory for me.
suppose for those who can't read between the lines. please stick the your mouse and keyboard... sarcasm might keel you over in the console camp ;)Quote:
Originally Posted by shadowfoxStatements like this just don't help at all. Agree to disagree, seriously. It's a matter of personal preference in the end. I prefer PC over consoles, not because I believe consoles suck, but because I - the exact opposoite of Azimuth, who likes the feel of the gamepad - prefer using a keyboard and mouse.Quote:
Originally Posted by Necuno
At the same time, there are games I prefer playing on consoles - fighting and racing games for instance. But FPS and MMORPGs will always be PC territory for me.
we got high level bosses like azimuth and larch...they hardly take prisoners, you might get send off to a S&M camp :D
Errr ... oops ... apologies.Quote:
Originally Posted by Necuno
I was going to add a line that I suspected you were making a tongue-in-cheek reference, but alas, in my haste to post ...
But with that mistake ... other people may miss the sarcasm. The reason for emotes - they should really include a sarcasm smiley.
but that would take away the surprise and caught out ones :eek:Quote:
Originally Posted by shadowfox
I see your Dragon Age and raise you Mass Effect 2, which is clearly console centric, even if it saw a PC release. As well as DA did, I'm guessing ME2 is going to make that success look like a blip on the radar.Quote:
Originally Posted by Stefan9
Look, I'm not saying PC gaming does not exist. Clearly it does, and will continue to. I'm saying it's dead in it's old form. There was a time PC gaming was huge, where it dominated the consoles and saw many more releases, more often. There was a time when PC games were ported to console rather than the other way round. That form of PC gaming has died, and a new form (one comprised mainly of mmo's, cross-platform games and 'engines'/tech demos) is being birthed from it's still warm corpse. PC gaming will likely never be as big as it once was. And that's fine. Hell, it shouldn't even matter, as long as you're enjoying it.
I couldn't agree more.Quote:
Originally Posted by Skurm
Not disagreeing with the majority of your comments only the one concerning Bioware. PC gaming has evolved and changed. Personally I don't really care which platform is dominant as long as the games I play gets released for pc I am happy. Personally I prefer more multi platform releases since it allows more people to play the games.Quote:
Originally Posted by Skurm
Ah. Well, yes. Bioware and Blizzard still fly the PC gaming flag high, no doubt. Not many other big publishers/developers left doing so, so good on them.
Bioware has taken the first step over to consoles with the Msss Effect series, though, and (arguably, i have no data to support this claim, but it's a suspicion) I would guess that's probably the more lucrative revenue stream for them right now. I won't be surprised if ME3 becomes an Xbox exclusive, for example. So I wouldn't be surprised to see them slowly shift focus over to the console market in the coming months and years. Blizzard is still 100% PC, but who knows what the future holds.
AFAIK, Mass Effect was Xbox 360 exclusive, then later it was ported to PC. Dragon Age was released for both PC and Console on the same day, as well as Mass Effect 2.
So clearly Bioware have noticed that the PC market is far from dead?
Same can be said for Modern Warfare 2. I quoted somewhere above, it sold only 170K units in the 1st week as compared to a couple million console sales in the same period. That's abysmal, relatively. But still 170K better than zero. When it comes to cross-platform titles, particularly on the Xbox-PC front, the cost-to-port is minimal. So, sure, it makes sense to port it to PC and get a couple extra units sold.
But it does mean that that's all PC gamers are really getting. Ports. PC gamers aren't getting their Uncharted's, their Gears of Wars, their Halo's or their Heavy Rain's. It has become something of a second rate, obscure medium, either paddling in the tepid waters of garage-sale handmedowns or cryptically dabbling in arcane curiosities. Perhaps the context was lost when I alledged it was a bona-fide rotting corpse. What I meant, and I guess I'll repeat it for clarity's sake, is that what it once was, is dead. And perhaps, just perhaps, something better can come from it's death.
MW2 got a lot of bad publicity on the PC. I know of many people that didn't buy it, purely because of that. Many of those people went out to buy the console version instead, since its appeal for playing it on the PC was non existent. Sad thing is, some just bought it for the single player. The thing that made MW1 on the PC such a success, was the multiplayer. Cut that out and you've instantly lost a lot of sales. (Anyways, I don't want to turn this into a whole MW2 dedicated servers debate)
Moving on; "Ports" should be deemed a thing of the past. It been proven many times now that games can successfully exist in the world of multi-platforms. Bioshock, Dragon Age, Mass Effect 1&2, MW2, Fallout 3, NFS, C&C etc etc etc. Yes, PC is not what it used to be. No longer is it the king of graphics or ultimate gaming platform, but it still is a good gaming platform. Hardware is still advancing at a rapid pace. And who knows; maybe this whole "online only DRM" might lead the PC gaming scene into something completely integrated, something like MMO's. Steam's been running like clockwork and people back then said that it would also fail.
The PC platform is so versatile that all the PC gaming industry needs for a resurrection is an innovative spark.
Seriously doudt it. BioWare have said on a few occasions now in order for an aaa title to be financially viable it needs to be multi platform.Quote:
Originally Posted by Skurm
On ME 3 being xbox 360 exclusive I think the chances are basicly 0. The reason I say this is because Mass Effect was initially schedule as an xbox 360 exclusive series and was advertised as this untill 1 month before the pc port was released, this was 5 months after the pc release. It make absolute zero sense now to not release me3 for pc as well considering ME 2 has sold very well on the pc, ME 1 was blighted by securom fiasco.
Also if you look at sales charts Dragon Age Origins pc has stayed in the top ten of a lot of pc sales charts around the world while the console version dropped out of the top 10 fairly quickly. So while the pc market might not make up as much of their revenue as the console sales it does still contribute.
BioWare in particular has a fairly a large pc fan base who will continue to buy their games. So it makes financial sense for them to cater to both the console and pc base.
S.T.A.L.K.E.R. :D thats our flagship :DQuote:
Originally Posted by Skurm
Amusingly, the Xbox Dragon Age port is shit. I mean, it's really horrible. Compared to Mass Effect 2 on Xbox, it's pathetic.Quote:
Originally Posted by RoosTa
As stated in my comment :)
Quote:
The main problem with gaming is there is always away to get around it.
I mean look at Counter Strike it had steam and took a little while to get a crack for it but people finally did, MW2 and soon Assassins Creed will be in the same boat might take a little while but some genius will do it.
The thing evolving around PC's is that what ever has a protection some one will get around it, banks, top secret computers, all are venerable to attack. If its on the net or has protection it will have a way to get around it no matter what. And that is where the PC industry has to fix.
The problem with a pc is that when you have the games installed and not playing it but on the internet. Those game makers are not allowed to search your pc and disable that game.
It reminds me of the criminal rights in south africa. I mean a guy rapes a girl and he gets caught. First thing is my rights, my rights state this my rights state that. Where are the dam rights for that girl?
Same with computers, the user has rights bla bla, but he has done a illegal act so those game makers should have the right to go on there and disable that illegal game.
Read tomorrows part 2 for another great comment :P
Another strike for PC gaming; Starcraft 2 beta cracked.
Don't these folks realise they shooting themselves in the foot? Soon there will be nothing left for them to crack. :rolleyes:
the warcraft 3 beta was also cracked as quickly. i can guarantee you that when the beta is over alot of the people who downloaded the cracked beta will move onto the battle.net servers with original products.Quote:
Originally Posted by RoosTa
i downloaded and played the war 3 beta on the ZA servers setup by local guys.... everyone on there knew it was just a temporary thing. more than 90% of the guys i knew on those servers went on to buy the original so we could play on the proper servers.
with battle.net 2 being as awesome as i hear it is.... i am quite confident that many of the players playing the cracked beta will buy the original.
the sales will speak for themselves i reckon.