'Blasphemous" Bioshock Infinite: upset gamer gets refund

[Avatar]

I, like the gamer mentioned above, am a devoted Christian. Furthermore, I am actually a Sunday school teacher! I will give my opinion here like I do with the Sunday school kids (all in grade 12). I have played the game, and I must say, that scene did make me a bit uncomfortable. I decided to play the game, seeing that as an important part of the story (after playing the scene I read up on the internet on the scene). At the end of the day it makes sense to put the scene in, but I wouldn't say it was a crucial part (IMO). I just wondered afterwards if the game couldn't have been just as great without the bombardment of religious images. I agree with one of the other comments, which is the same as what I tell the Sunday school kids. Each one of us know what we are comfortable with, as a Christian or non-Christian. Each one of us will draw the line based on our upbringing, morals and religion. I can not tell you where to draw line, and you can not tell me where to draw line, that is your own issue, and it is issue which I decide through thought, prayer and discussions like these. This game was on the edge of that line for me, finished it, will not play it again.

Well said, IMO. I just disagree in that I do believe the bombardment, as you accurately called it, was necessary. Bioshock had a similar thing with the messiah complex and it made for a great story on the frailty of man wielding power.

Either way, if you think the baptism scene wasn't a crucial part of the story then I think you didn't quite understand the story. The baptism is pretty much what the entire story hinges on, but I'll not go into further detail here for fear of posting spoilers for those who have not yet played the game.

Ty for making this a spoiler friendly post.

But... it's fiction. The protagonist (READ: not you) is being baptized under a fictional religion. Is it really that bad watching something fictional happen in a fictional setting?

That comes down to the all-important question of immersion in games. Do we 'become' the protagonist while we play? What if it's a clearly defined character with a clearly defined story? IMO, that's exactly where I see the original article's complaint's valid point; if the gamer were to be completely immersed in the game, I can completely understand the baptism scene being a very real and traumatic experience.. It was for our protagonist, wasn't it? I've got to say, I was only half paying attention at that point, as my girlfriend was saying something to me, until I hit the button to 'accept baptism'. It was powerful and jarring, to say the least. IMO, though, this makes for a good game, if handled correctly.


EDIT: And thank you for the +rep on my previous post, 'preciate it.

[Juvenile]

If I am not physically or emotionally affected by something, it doesn't matter to me. (real-world matters not gaming matters).

When this person watches a movie or series and someone utters the words "Jesus Christ" or "Oh my God"; do they write a complaint to the broadcasting company requesting that their money be paid back - for such blasphemy used in the programs?

[JP'S]

I love religious imagery in games, books, movies etc. It somehow creates depth and makes things sinister,like in Dan Brown's books

This.

I didn't really have a problem with the scene... Even though I'm a christian. It's all fictional anyway

[Saint_Dee]

Propaganda vs. a portrayal of disturbing themes (I think there is a distinction between disturbing and offensive).

Was the scene created as an attack on any religion or was it a portrayal of a theme in context of the game and its setting?

To draw from a slightly unrelated example, I recently watched Django Unchained, one of the most disturbing and uncomfortable themes in the movie is slavery, and some of the scenes are pretty disturbing (some of them certainly disturbed me), but as black person, I wasn't offended, instead I understood the necessity for these scenes in context of the time and setting of the movie, and it wasn't promoting slavery or anything to that effect. I probably would've enjoyed the movie less if they'd tiptoed around the issues of the world and setting they'd created for the movie in that specific timeline (the movie was a genuinely authentic experience and window into that world).

Back to infinite, was the scene propaganda or a necessary portrayal of a theme found in the game? I have yet to play it, but if the scene is pivotal or crutial to the story and setting of the game, and it works, then as a Christian I think there's no inherent problem because it's not trying to spread propaganda, but rather give an authentic experience of the setting and story. It's not an attack on any religion, but rather a grim outlook on the story, characters, and setting of the game.

Like another poster mentioned above, as different as we are, we are offended by different things whether or not they are intended to offend.

Not the best worded response, but that's my 2 cents.

[Lyt]

It's a game, a very good one for that, and I say just fukkit and play. You will have a much better time playing it rather than arguing with people here. This has turned into a religion discussion, and we all know there's no end to that.

Also I don't approve of Valve giving a refund to that man. Any sucker that buys a game and doesn't like it or finds something that offends him can pull the same string and get a refund.

[JP'S]

It's a game, a very good one for that, and I say just fukkit and play. You will have a much better time playing it rather than arguing with people here. This has turned into a religion discussion, and we all know there's no end to that.

Also I don't approve of Valve giving a refund to that man. Any sucker that buys a game and doesn't like it or finds something that offends him can pull the same string and get a refund.

It really was a good game. I can't argue with that.

It just shows that Valve cares for its customers.

[B1nary]

Okay let me chuck in my two cents here, I am a christian I have chosen not to play certain games in the past because of the content.

Now here is the tricky bit, you cant pin a person down and say oh you don't like the baptism part but violence is okay so now your a hypocrite. Depending on your belief and in this case specifically when it comes to Christianity scripture says if you are convicted by something then don't do it or its sin(referring to moral grey areas), now im not going to get into the semantics of it here but essentially what im trying to point out is, its our choice to what we expose ourselves to and it is the responsibility of the publisher to provide the consumer with enough information to make a proper choice.

I for one really wish they would put some kind of blasphemy warning on games and movies, if they can do it with swearing why not religious blasphemous words and scenes.(yes im aware that some titles have this but its a rarity)

sites like plugged-in are handy at times but don't always provide relevant information in a timely fashion, with such readily available access to the internet and the fact that most gamers obviously have it, it would be great if some form of database was available to people wanting to check game content.

[Graal]

The thing is, there's no blasphemy in the game. There's a baptism, and that's it.

[Avatar]

To draw from a slightly unrelated example, I recently watched Django Unchained, one of the most disturbing and uncomfortable themes in the movie is slavery, and some of the scenes are pretty disturbing (some of them certainly disturbed me), but as black person, I wasn't offended, instead I understood the necessity for these scenes in context of the time and setting of the movie, and it wasn't promoting slavery or anything to that effect. I probably would've enjoyed the movie less if they'd tiptoed around the issues of the world and setting they'd created for the movie in that specific timeline (the movie was a genuinely authentic experience and window into that world).

Back to infinite, was the scene propaganda or a necessary portrayal of a theme found in the game? I have yet to play it, but if the scene is pivotal or crutial to the story and setting of the game, and it works, then as a Christian I think there's no inherent problem because it's not trying to spread propaganda, but rather give an authentic experience of the setting and story. It's not an attack on any religion, but rather a grim outlook on the story, characters, and setting of the game.

Like another poster mentioned above, as different as we are, we are offended by different things whether or not they are intended to offend.

Not the best worded response, but that's my 2 cents.

I disagree, I think you're comparison with Django Unchained very eloquently sums up how I feel about the portrayal vs. condonement/promotion thing. Well put, IMO.

Okay let me chuck in my two cents here, I am a christian I have chosen not to play certain games in the past because of the content.

This is certainly a fair point; we've all chosen not to play certain games for different criteria. Some dislike violence and gore in games, so they avoided violent games. Some dislike shitty gameplay, so they avoided Superman 64 and ET, and Alian: Colonial Marines. I think the important thing, in general, is that we get to make an informed decision as to what we avoid and what not. The ESBR rating gives us a fair view on violence, metacritic and the internet at large helps us with reviews, but there was nothing to help the client in the article.

Maybe there should be..

[Pooky]

How about they just put a 'religious content' sticker on it?

Although I hardly doubt there are many people who care about such things so it may not be worth the bother.