Are games art? Do you care?

[DenSweeP]

"Art is the process or product of deliberately arranging elements in a way to affect the senses or emotions. It encompasses a diverse range of human activities, creations, and modes of expression, including music, literature, film, photography, sculpture, and paintings. The meaning of art is explored in a branch of philosophy known as aesthetics............Traditionally, the term art was used to refer to any skill or mastery. This conception changed during the Romantic period, when art came to be seen as "a special faculty of the human mind to be classified with religion and science".[2] Generally, art is made with the intention of stimulating thoughts and emotions."

As quoted from wikipedia.

Well games evoke thoughts and emotions. Emotions such as rage, enjoyment, happiness, laughing etc, have happened to me whilst gaming and is therefore in my opinion art. Simple question, simple answer based on the above definition.

[jasong]

It's not as simple a question as that...

[Jabberwocky]

So
Pictures is art
Music is art
Story is art

Interactive pictures with music and a story is not art?

I don`t get it

a game is a product of of many artists.. from modelers to programmers.

[DenSweeP]

It kiiinda is. (David Spade from Rules of Engagement)

The question is: "Are games art?"

By the definition I gave, they are. The elicit emotions and are expressions of someone's creativity. Ok, the expressions was kinda my own thought, but I think that is the whole point. Art is down to personal taste. Which come to think of it now, is maybe the what the question is trying to ask or should have asked. Do you find games to be art? Because in the strictest definition IMHO, it is. But that is what makes art what it is, matter of personal taste. You might not like the Mona Lisa say, or the statue of David, but is still art. Just because someone might find something ugly,distasteful etc, or not understand the subject, doesn't mean it isn't art.

[DenSweeP]

Crap, my bad, double post.

[jasong]

That's ok lol. It isn't so simple because of the reason I gave above: Yes in the broad dictionary sense games are technically an art form. But the issue is whether games will ever be able to produce great art, art that can stand up next to its novel, poem, painting (etc) masterpiece counterparts? And if they are, what form would that take? How would we know it if we saw it?

[tehNihilist]

Hmm... I get where you are going jasong. I come from a family of artists and I oddly find myself struggling to define what is art for a myriad of reasons.

I have thought about this topic and I would like for the gaming medium to be considered art, sure it shares elements with art, but it lacks depth due to its nature.

Would a game ever be great / fine art? No, I highly doubt it. As it stands the gaming industry is primarily shallow affair. Sure I do experience emotional events, but nothing that truly stirs my soul like say a great piece of music does. However I do believe if a group like-minded people got together to create art in this medium they could very well achieve it. But as it is gaming is entertainment, and is created as such.

The question for most is not whether a game can be art, but more what IS art. And that alone is a complex affair.

[DenSweeP]

Problem is games will in all likelihood never be seen as a masterpiece by art gurus, because they will always see it as juvenile computer games. It's not like we will ever see games being displayed in the Louvre or The Metropolitan.

For what it's worth, I really think Heavy Rain is either or very close to being a great piece of art. Stunning visuals, awesome soundtrack and a very gripping storyline. But like I say, art will always be a matter of personal taste.

[Murph]

That's ok lol. It isn't so simple because of the reason I gave above: Yes in the broad dictionary sense games are technically an art form. But the issue is whether games will ever be able to produce great art, art that can stand up next to its novel, poem, painting (etc) masterpiece counterparts? And if they are, what form would that take? How would we know it if we saw it?

Good argument. Something that is meant to "amuse children" will never reach the status of high art simply because it doesn't get taken seriously in that sense. So, high art - doubtful in our lifetime. Art in general - absolutely without question.

[jasong]

Yeah you see... I actually do like playing highbrow, indie, critically rated videogames and reading Edge and the rest of it. I guess I'm a bit of a poncey gamer heh. You have a handful of games that are always held up as examples of real bona fide works of art - Shadow of the Colossus, Flower, Heavy Rain. Whether they actually qualify as real art is another matter, but they are certainly closer to the traditional definition of art than the average gun orgy.

The issue that I raised above though really plagues me - the dichotomy between the story, if there is one, and the actual gameplay, which is where the 'real' heart of the game is IMO. An RPG isn't 'about' a group of characters saving the world or something, it's about strategic turn-based battles, careful resource management, upgrading and so forth. And if it succeeds in one direction but fails in the gameplay, it fails completely.

Recognizing something as art is a remedial task - acknowledging a masterpiece in an unfamiliar medium is a completely different challenge. Zelda: OoT is usually considered the greatest game of all time but its story is laughable. It succeeds on the terms of videogaming - level design, coherence of world, puzzles, and other elements that have nothing to do with classical great art.