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[MENTION=23109]Cappie[/MENTION], Ryan Reynolds was born to play Deadpool, X-Men Origins: Wolverine wasn't his fault, it was down to studio choices and Green Lantern was also a directorial issue in my opinion. I reckon he could've been able to play Hal Jordan if he given the proper direction at the time. Also, since we're getting a green lantern corps movie down the line, I really hope we get to see Kyle Rayner, John Stewart, and Guy Gardner. Hal is probably my least favorite of the lanterns.



Career destroying movie? That's a bit hyperbolic considering when that movie happened. The Town? Argo? These two out a good number of flicks have shown that he has the acting and directorial chops to be involved as Batman. I reckon he'll knock the performance out of the park (he might end up being the definitive Batman for a generation of Superhero movie fans, just as Michael Keaton, and Christian Bale occupied a similar spot in Batman fandom).

I do agree with the sentiments on Sandler though, that man is a lost cause in terms of trying to make good movies at this point. I actually didn't hate Pixels, but it was such a missed opportunity because it ended being another "Adam Sandler movie"

Technically Affleck’s career wasn’t fully destroyed by Gigli, but I think the dire years following that film’s release constitute a acting death. But then some bright spark suggested a career switch to directing and things have exploded from there. And with his follow ups to initial hit Gone Baby Gone, he’s back to lead actor status too
 
Technically Affleck’s career wasn’t fully destroyed by Gigli, but I think the dire years following that film’s release constitute a acting death. But then some bright spark suggested a career switch to directing and things have exploded from there. And with his follow ups to initial hit Gone Baby Gone, he’s back to lead actor status too

I don't really think Gigli did any real harm to his acting career...

Paycheck was a pretty good movie imo. and don't forget about Argo.
 
Christian Bale for me has been the best Batman, I know it has to happen, but i feel like DC change their actors to often, and dont use their successful series actors to bring that onto the big screen. I would love to see Grant Gustin as the flash and Stephen Amell as the arrow in the Justice League, but it will never happen. DC should have pushed to have Christian Bale remain, for this movie at least... But the whole "aging Batman" thing with Ben affleck I think is retarded... The should have gone with a younger actor who can keep the role and make it his own, like you said, for a generation to come, along with the justice league...

Look at Wolverine for example? Hugh Jackman IS Wolverine. The way he has owned that role has been Epic.

As for Adam Sandler... The last good movie this guy made was Happy Gilmore... Pixels was such a crock of shit... It had so much potential and it fell so very far short...

First, I'll address the idea of Christian Bale being Batman in the new DCCU. That can't work. Why not? Well, Nolan essentially made a complete and self-contained thing with the Dark Knight trilogy, and Christian Bale is the definitive Batman for that brand. Bringing him into a different universe always runs the risk of associating that brand with the new Brand they're to build, that's just the reality they had to grapple with there. Secondly, The Dark Knight Returns is a pretty prolific storyline that exists and is pretty good (or at least it is according to most people who'd tell you that it was a gamechanger in comic writing. So the aging Batman thing isn't new, it just hasn't been done on the big screen), so I don't necessary think there's much of problem with giving us that type of Batman interpretation, especially bearing in mind we've never gotten this interpretation on screen yet. Mark my words, Ben Affleck is going to be the definitive Batman for a few generations to come (if the movies are good). Batfleck might even direct the next Batman, which is an interesting prospect in and of itself.

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And now, the differing philosophies of Marvel and DC when it comes to how expansive their universes are.

Here's the thing (take my contrary 2c for what they're worth). There are so many things to consider here.

Firstly, what Marvel has works with a connected universe for multiple reasons (I'm going to refer mainly to the Disney Umbrella as opposed to the Fox or Sony stuff). Firstly their, cinematic universe as started by the Iron Man movie has largely had a good number of hits which has allowed the brand to expand said universe into the TV realm with shows like Agents of S.H.I.E.L.D, Agent Carter, Daredevil, Jessica Jones (these last two, by the way, are street level heroes by the way, which is important to remember).

Now yes, they're all in one universe and if you're a dedicated fan, that's great if you're concerned with continuity and the like, and that's the positive side of things. The negative side of the coin is that the TV universe (Agents of SHIELD in particular) feels constrained somewhat in terms of what they can do plot-wise because of the movies (Daredevil, Jessica Jones, and the coming Netflix offerings have avoided this largely in part as a result of the somewhat self-contained nature of the Netflix universe with the odd tie-in back to the larger universe). So in my opinion, the tie-in of shield to the larger universe has hurt it somewhat (I watched season 1 and part of season 2 and it felt lackluster... but that's just my subjective view). But overall Marvel has found a formula that works... for them. Please note, pre Iron Man, Marvel had just as many troubles in terms in terms having a bankable thing (Ang Lee's Hulk, the Daredevil movie, etc)

DC on the other hand have opted for a different approach, letting the TV and Cinematic universes be separate from each, and at first glance it sounds like a flawed plan, until you consider that regardless of Nolan's Batman trilogy (and maybe Smallville with the cult fandom, which I'm a part of:o), in recent years DC's name isn't as trusted as Marvel's is. So it doesn't surprise me that they wanted their TV properties to have no creative shackles as a result of the cinematic universe (honestly, like look at what The Flash and Arrow are doing right now because they can tell the stories they want to tell us about whatever incarnation of the characters they're selling us). As reader of both publishers' comics DC catalogue probably has more elseworld tales than any other publisher, which means there's a plethora of stories to pool from in the source material, which means we as viewers can get even more stories with different interpretations of our favorite characters. So for example we're going to get Ezra Miller as The Flash in the movies and that's fine, because as much as I love Grant Gustin, I'm keen to see how they interpret him in the movies vs the show (because the comics themselves have different interpretations of each Flash, and a lot of the other characters). I mean some of my favorite Flash or Superman stories aren't even in the same comic continuity or by the same writers.

tl;dr (I'm rambling), Marvel has found THEIR formula and it works for them, and the upside is a continuity that spans over a vast array of properties and characters, but it runs the risk of shackling creativity of the network shows like Agents of Shield. While DC have chosen to give the TV and Movie universe a bit more freedom by separating them, which might have us seeing similar characters in TV and cinema while having a wider variety of stories and character interpretations to enjoy. And I think that's a formula that'll probably work out better for them as opposed to Marvel's formula, especially considering that even their comic book history and philosophy is somewhat radically different. Basically 20*5 = 100, 25*4 = 100, 1000/10 = 100. Essentially, neither Marvel or DC are infallible, but I think fans give them less credit than they're due for the logic or thought process behind some of their decisions.

P.S. I've never understood why fans are afraid of different interpretations of characters and different adaptations of stories, especially in comic book movie genre, where the source material itself is notorious or famous (depending on how you look at it) for doing that very same thing.

P.P.S. I'm not proclaiming to have definitive answers because I could totally be pulling things out my ass, but I just feel like fans in general are somewhat dismissive in their opinions at times, and need to be a little more open minded in their processing of this stuff.

Addendum A: [MENTION=4613]TheAvenged87[/MENTION] and I had a similar discussion about this way back:

IMHO DC made an error by splitting up the cinematic universe from the TV universe, as they will contain the same characters. You'll have two versions of the same character. That fits the parallel universe-bill from comic books, but they could be doing so much more. That's another show I haven't watched: Agents of SHIELD.

Initially, those were my thoughts, but as I thought about it I realized that it would be beyond ambitious to try and maintain a TV and Cinematic universe as one continuity, or at least in the case of the DC properties.

For one I would worry about the barrier of entry for viewers. Look at Marvel's cinematic stuff, a great catalogue and Agents of SHIELD (I've yet to watch it myself but I hear good things) adds on to that universe and for the most part Marvel has handled the continuous universe pretty well, but imagine if DC takes that approach considering the number of shows they have (Arrow, Flash, Supergirl, and goodness knows what else is in the pipelines... I don't know where Constantine stands, but Gotham is on the outskirts), the pressure for TV shows to keep in line with bigger picture of the DCCU would be heavy and might constrict some of the creativity of these shows, their take on the heroes and their villains, and the continuity could get convoluted. Also, I think from a viewer point of view, I think it's a nice contrast to see how the shows give us their detailed perspective on the characters vs the movies which are trying to tell tighter, more controlled stories. And as you mentioned, there is multiverse idea around the DC stuff although I doubt they'll capitalize on that since using the multiverse is a bit too ambitious... as far I can tell. It would be great though.

I do get what you're saying. I do think making it one universe would have probably worked better if they chose other stories for the TV Shows the way that Agents of Shield doesn't focus on the heroes from the movies. That way, we would still get unique stories while having them linked to the movies. But then again, Marvel's name garners more trust than DC, which means everything that DC does is riskier in terms of movies or shows, and making +10 movies along +3 TV Shows (TV shows that hope for longevity) that are meant to be in the same universe (which probably means choosing other stories for their TV shows which could be hit or miss). It sounds way to o risky a move for DC.

I think I'm a bit dillerious at this point. I haven't written a "2c" post in a loooooong while.

EDIT: Seriously, read if you dare.
 
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[MENTION=8104]Saint_Dee[/MENTION] Wow that was a hell of a post "whistling:

Where to start... Jeez...

Ok so i do completely hear what you are saying about Nolan's take on the Batman Trilogy, and that that in its self is a "contained" series, and I can appreciate that. And also im a big fan of the "aged" Batman from the comics, it makes for a much more interesting plot as opposed to a younger stronger batman that isnt necessarily as "weathered" by the roll of Gotham's protector. And while I dont see a problem with them going for the older version of Batman it does concern me of the longevity of this "series" with Affleck (i refuse to call him Batfleck...) I dont for a second think he wont do the roll justice, I just hope that they keep him around for a relatively long time. I hate it when actors keep changing in rolls. This has completely ruined The Hulk for me...

Then, from my point of view, Im definitely not afraid of seeing different interpretations of the superheroes, heck i think Miles Morales as Spiderman is LONG overdue... But yes you are correct, I am probably trying to put all my Characters into their own individual baskets, when in reality (Well comic book reality) there are so many "Multi-verses" that there are multiple interpretations of the different characters... Im loving what the Flash is doing at the moment with "Earth 2" With another Flash over there, but completely different, Both Marvel and DC do it...

I do hear what you are saying about the creative freedom, and in that regard you have probably opened my eyes a bit... I have always thought about most Super Hero movies, and when they are in trouble, why dont other hero's just sort it out for them... Like watching Captain America after the Avengers, I couldn't help but think, Why the fuck doesn't Iron man/Thor/Hulk, etc etc just come help him, but that wouldn't be a story about Captain America then would it...

I think to a large extent the success of Flash and Arrow have come from both basically having no mention of Superman or Batman, etc etc, and you have made me realize that if that did happen the show wouldn't be about Flash anymore, and then people would constantly ask why doesn't Superman just come save the day...

Maybe we should move this chat to the comic thread :wtf:
 
First, I'll address the idea of Christian Bale being Batman in the new DCCU. That can't work. Why not? Well, Nolan essentially made a complete and self-contained thing with the Dark Knight trilogy, and Christian Bale is the definitive Batman for that brand. Bringing him into a different universe always runs the risk of associating that brand with the new Brand they're to build, that's just the reality they had to grapple with there. Secondly, The Dark Knight Returns is a pretty prolific storyline that exists and is pretty good (or at least it is according to most people who'd tell you that it was a gamechanger in comic writing. So the aging Batman thing isn't new, it just hasn't been done on the big screen), so I don't necessary think there's much of problem with giving us that type of Batman interpretation, especially bearing in mind we've never gotten this interpretation on screen yet. Mark my words, Ben Affleck is going to be the definitive Batman for a few generations to come (if the movies are good). Batfleck might even direct the next Batman, which is an interesting prospect in and of itself.

------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------

And now, the differing philosophies of Marvel and DC when it comes to how expansive their universes are.

Here's the thing (take my contrary 2c for what they're worth). There are so many things to consider here.

Firstly, what Marvel has works with a connected universe for multiple reasons (I'm going to refer mainly to the Disney Umbrella as opposed to the Fox or Sony stuff). Firstly their, cinematic universe as started by the Iron Man movie has largely had a good number of hits which has allowed the brand to expand said universe into the TV realm with shows like Agents of S.H.I.E.L.D, Agent Carter, Daredevil, Jessica Jones (these last two, by the way, are street level heroes by the way, which is important to remember).

Now yes, they're all in one universe and if you're a dedicated fan, that's great if you're concerned with continuity and the like, and that's the positive side of things. The negative side of the coin is that the TV universe (Agents of SHIELD in particular) feels constrained somewhat in terms of what they can do plot-wise because of the movies (Daredevil, Jessica Jones, and the coming Netflix offerings have avoided this largely in part as a result of the somewhat self-contained nature of the Netflix universe with the odd tie-in back to the larger universe). So in my opinion, the tie-in of shield to the larger universe has hurt it somewhat (I watched season 1 and part of season 2 and it felt lackluster... but that's just my subjective view). But overall Marvel has found a formula that works... for them. Please note, pre Iron Man, Marvel had just as many troubles in terms in terms having a bankable thing (Ang Lee's Hulk, the Daredevil movie, etc)

DC on the other hand have opted for a different approach, letting the TV and Cinematic universes be separate from each, and at first glance it sounds like a flawed plan, until you consider that regardless of Nolan's Batman trilogy (and maybe Smallville with the cult fandom, which I'm a part of:o), in recent years DC's name isn't as trusted as Marvel's is. So it doesn't surprise me that they wanted their TV properties to have no creative shackles as a result of the cinematic universe (honestly, like look at what The Flash and Arrow are doing right now because they can tell the stories they want to tell us about whatever incarnation of the characters they're selling us). As reader of both publishers' comics DC catalogue probably has more elseworld tales than any other publisher, which means there's a plethora of stories to pool from in the source material, which means we as viewers can get even more stories with different interpretations of our favorite characters. So for example we're going to get Ezra Miller as The Flash in the movies and that's fine, because as much as I love Grant Gustin, I'm keen to see how they interpret him in the movies vs the show (because the comics themselves have different interpretations of each Flash, and a lot of the other characters). I mean some of my favorite Flash or Superman stories aren't even in the same comic continuity or by the same writers.

tl;dr (I'm rambling), Marvel has found THEIR formula and it works for them, and the upside is a continuity that spans over a vast array of properties and characters, but it runs the risk of shackling creativity of the network shows like Agents of Shield. While DC have chosen to give the TV and Movie universe a bit more freedom by separating them, which might have us seeing similar characters in TV and cinema while having a wider variety of stories and character interpretations to enjoy. And I think that's a formula that'll probably work out better for them as opposed to Marvel's formula, especially considering that even their comic book history and philosophy is somewhat radically different. Basically 20*5 = 100, 25*4 = 100, 1000/10 = 100. Essentially, neither Marvel or DC are infallible, but I think fans give them less credit than they're due for the logic or thought process behind some of their decisions.

P.S. I've never understood why fans are afraid of different interpretations of characters and different adaptations of stories, especially in comic book movie genre, where the source material itself is notorious or famous (depending on how you look at it) for doing that very same thing.

P.P.S. I'm not proclaiming to have definitive answers because I could totally be pulling things out my ass, but I just feel like fans in general are somewhat dismissive in their opinions at times, and need to be a little more open minded in their processing of this stuff.

Addendum A: [MENTION=4613]TheAvenged87[/MENTION] and I had a similar discussion about this way back:





I think I'm a bit dillerious at this point. I haven't written a "2c" post in a loooooong while.

EDIT: Seriously, read if you dare.

...Marvel > DC "whistling:
 
So have you seen it to make such a statement? It's a billionaire dressed like a bat fighting an alien with superpowers... making sense is not high on the priority list

HAHA! you know what I mean!

There is no way Batman should even be able to throw a punch at Superman
 
HAHA! you know what I mean!

There is no way Batman should even be able to throw a punch at Superman

Yet in every movie Superman nearly dies... So if lowly criminals can nearly kill Superman, Batman should be able to throw a punch. Right?
 
HAHA! you know what I mean!

There is no way Batman should even be able to throw a punch at Superman

That's the exact question they want us asking after seeing that trailer. How did he do that? Does that mean Kryptonite will be introduced? etc...

But which Kryptonite? Green, Red, Anti-Kryptonite, X-Kryptonite, Blue, White, Red-Green, Gold, Red-Green-Blue-Gold, Silver, Jewel, Bizarro Red, Green-Red, Red-Gold, Magno-Kryptonite, Red-Green-Gold, Slow, Kryptonite-X, Pink, Black, Orange or Periwinkle?

Is the Batsuit infused with Green Kryptonite? We'll have to wait and see I guess...
 
That's the exact question they want us asking after seeing that trailer. How did he do that? Does that mean Kryptonite will be introduced? etc...

and therein lie my problem with this movie. there is no kryptonite. there was no meteor shower and there is no way there ever could be one.

the only theory I can come up with is that they found chunks of Krypton in the World Engine. but then why didn't that play a role in Man of Steel? instead they did that dumb atmosphere thing.

It just all feels a bit slap dash to me, but that's kinda what I have come to expect from the DCMU

but that's just my opinion. we'll have to wait and see what Snyder presents
 
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