2nd Hand Books/DVDs and games

[simon]

Howzit guys,
I know this might be a bit of a biased place to ask this question, but I am just wondering people's thoughts on this.
Do you believe that the sale of second hand goods is ok.
I can look at it from both sides of the argument but having other people's opinions might help me make up my mind. The reason why I am asking this is that I am thinking of starting a swap shop for games and dvd's at my work after buying the company.

So on the one hand, if you buy a game or dvd etc you should own the rights to do with it as you please so long as you don't make copies etc. So if you wish to sell it then it should be fair to do so...
However if you look at it from the developer's perspective then you are taking away the potential of them selling a new item and they therefore do not make the money from some other sucker wanting to buy their product.
Or is there some royalties law that I am missing out on with Cash Crusaders et al.

 

[Lycanthrope]

Selling any IP second-hand takes a "potential sale" from the original author/developer.

Whether those kinds of copyright laws (you may not hire, trade, sell, display, duplicate, copy or strangely eyeball (etc) this property without permission of the copyright holder) are actually enforceable under South African law is entirely debatable.

I firmly believe that if you've provided legal tender in exchange for an item, that item and everything about it becomes yours, just like the money, in its entirety, you exchanged it for becomes theirs.

If legal tender worked the way copyright does you'd be telling them how they may or may not spend it after the exchange too

 

[Prometheus]

My sentiments are that if you bought it you can sell it. Even if you didn't buy it and just got it you can sell it. Same as with physical goods.

But you should be careful with DRM. Steam games are the worst and virtually worthless after the key is used. Others may require registration on the publisher's website which is harder to know if it's not a steam title.

 

[ingeon]

This IP thing is getting out of hand. I`ve read a few articles the last while that led me to the following statement.
I bought it from a shop with cash, I didn`t sign a document when I bought it from the shop, so when I`m done with it, there is nothing prohibiting me from selling my book/CD/DVD/Console game when I feel I`m done with it, it`s taking up space at home.
That would be trying to control our basic human rights

As Prometheus pointed out, most PC games and maybe some console have DRM hangups.

 

[Orihalcon]

I have absolutely ZERO qualms about selling off my second hand items. Whether that is hardware, books, games, DVD's etc etc et al, I feel I have that right. Until there exists a law that expressly prohibits the sale of second and goods [good luck getting that to pass, much less getting people to adhere to it] I will continue to do just that - sell my stuff in fair trade to whoever is interested.

 

[simon]

I bought it from a shop with cash, I didn`t sign a document when I bought it from the shop, so when I`m done with it, there is nothing prohibiting me from selling my book/CD/DVD/Console game when I feel I`m done with it, it`s taking up space at home.
That would be trying to control our basic human rights

Yeah, I agree with you.
However after studying a bit of business law I learnt something. When there is something in the shop the producer is "offering" it. When you buy it you accept it. Its the basic formula of a contract, offer and acceptance.
So when you have bought something you are entering in a contract with the producer of said good. If it says in the product that you are not allowed to sell said product then you can't sell it otherwise you are then in breach of contract.
But does that mean sell the plan of the game / make copies and sell them or just sell your one copy to a shop or friend.
I am in a real pickle over this

 

[Prometheus]

I have absolutely ZERO qualms about selling off my second hand items. Whether that is hardware, books, games, DVD's etc etc et al, I feel I have that right. Until there exists a law that expressly prohibits the sale of second and goods [good luck getting that to pass, much less getting people to adhere to it] I will continue to do just that - sell my stuff in fair trade to whoever is interested.

Only problem with that is said license product now.

Yeah, I agree with you.
However after studying a bit of business law I learnt something. When there is something in the shop the producer is "offering" it. When you buy it you accept it. Its the basic formula of a contract, offer and acceptance.
So when you have bought something you are entering in a contract with the producer of said good. If it says in the product that you are not allowed to sell said product then you can't sell it otherwise you are then in breach of contract.
But does that mean sell the plan of the game / make copies and sell them or just sell your one copy to a shop or friend.
I am in a real pickle over this

Yeah but isn't it just commonly accepted as a contract between buyer and seller? That is how I understood it to be and not a literal contract that you sign and can dictate.

I'm sure I can make the case in a court of law that I can sell whatever product I buy. We are in completely new territory here. Now comes someone and they say they are not selling me a product but a license to use something. They are telling me I can't resell that license, only use it in such and such a way, use it only in one place, for a limited time, and in the case of Jelsoft it doesn't even matter how many copies you are running but the number of urls you use it with. It just gets more and more restrictive with no case law to challenge or enforce it.

For now I say it's open market. Nobody keeps a receipt so there's no way they can prove anything.

 

[DenSweeP]

I say sell whatever you can. You paid for it, it becomes yours. If it's software that has been registered to you with a specific licence, that becomes another matter entirely of course.

I can see no reason why any other software, game, movie, book etc cannot be reasonably sold second hand. All these laws etc are merely very large and powerful corporations who can buy governments to pass these restrictions as law, thereby making the corporations even more money.

 

[myjdjames]

I say sell whatever you can. You paid for it, it becomes yours. If it's software that has been registered to you with a specific licence, that becomes another matter entirely of course.

I can see no reason why any other software, game, movie, book etc cannot be reasonably sold second hand. All these laws etc are merely very large and powerful corporations who can buy governments to pass these restrictions as law, thereby making the corporations even more money.

i fully agree with this. Its yours .. you should be able to pass it on (unless u specifically accepted so EULA)

 

[simon]

Thanks for the help everyone. I will start one up in the coming months. You guys should come through and check it out when it is up and running nicely.