Carmageddon: Reincarnation

Eugene said:
It's too much of a gamble. None of the projects I've kickstarted so far have come out yet, and there is no guarantee that any of them will turn out any good.
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Absolutely.

I don't agree with Early Access or pre-ordering either, why buy something before you know it's good or complete for that matter. I despise the early access/pre-order culture that currently infests gaming. Kickstarter-wise I avoid video games for the most part, but there are some great boardgame kickstarters out there. I always imagine you're more of a venture capitalist when you opt into a kickstarter rather than a consumer.

On the topic of Carmageddon I really hope they don't mess it up, but on the upside at least it's not a mobile reboot like Dungeon Keeper or Rollercoaster Tycoon 4.
 
GazWorks said:
Absolutely.

I don't agree with Early Access or pre-ordering either, why buy something before you know it's good or complete for that matter. I despise the early access/pre-order culture that currently infests gaming. Kickstarter-wise I avoid video games for the most part, but there are some great boardgame kickstarters out there. I always imagine you're more of a venture capitalist when you opt into a kickstarter rather than a consumer.

On the topic of Carmageddon I really hope they don't mess it up, but on the upside at least it's not a mobile reboot like Dungeon Keeper or Rollercoaster Tycoon 4.
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I'm with you on this. Early Access is like allowing you to read the rough drafts of your favorite author's newest book before it's been corrected and ran past an editor. It may sound like fun at first until you get the final product and realize you already know the story and all the magic of the book is destroyed for you.

Or even worse, the author realizes he's already sold thousands of copies and completing the book won't yield that much more sales. So he dumps the book and moves on to the next project.
 
Wyzak said:
So at the same time none of them have been epic failures? :D
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Some have potential to be good, there are a few I'm not happy with at all. I see no reason to take chances with my money anymore. It's always better to wait for other people's opinions first.


GazWorks said:
On the topic of Carmageddon I really hope they don't mess it up, but on the upside at least it's not a mobile reboot like Dungeon Keeper or Rollercoaster Tycoon 4.
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There is already a version of Carmageddon on mobile, and it's pretty damn good actually. It's a straight port of the original though.
 
Mister 44 said:
I'm with you on this. Early Access is like allowing you to read the rough drafts of your favorite author's newest book before it's been corrected and ran past an editor. It may sound like fun at first until you get the final product and realize you already know the story and all the magic of the book is destroyed for you.
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It's quite simply really, if you don't like to do that don't do that. But I like the fact that some games have the option for those who would like to test them.

I'll let you guys get back to the topic of Carmageddon then :D I proper reboot would be awesome.
 
Just a warning, reading the forums this game is extremely un-optimized to the point of X-Rebirth performance.

It seems you gonna need an overclocked 4Ghz Cpu to be able to run it alright in it's current state.
 
This was successfully kickstarted two years ago and they're only now in pre-alpha?

No thanks. I'll get this the day it releases and not a day sooner.
 
Wyzak said:
It's quite simply really, if you don't like to do that don't do that. But I like the fact that some games have the option for those who would like to test them.

I'll let you guys get back to the topic of Carmageddon then :D I proper reboot would be awesome.
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Early Access or not, this one is going into my wishlist. The original was a heavy influence on my driving style.
 
I loved the original, but the last "issue" i played was so shit... and this doesnt look any better...

It annoys me when people take things i like and f#%k them up...
 
Wyzak said:
It's quite simply really, if you don't like to do that don't do that. But I like the fact that some games have the option for those who would like to test them.
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I disagree, steam is inundated with early access games, it's very easy to slap that label on your product and let it sit in development limbo all the while grabbing funds from people. Publishers and devs listen to the money not the people so if you see gamers chomping at the bit for unfinished products what kind of message does that send? Easy pickings and an exploitable trend. That's not to mention things like game burn out, the fact the product might not see the light of day at all and the fact that they are charging people for something that they pay actual testers to test.

Of course that's not to say all Early Access games are bad, Starbound for example is very good, but it's one of the very few that is nestled among things like 7 Days To Die which when it popped up as Early Access had a broken stealth system that was practically required to play the game successfully. There are LOADS of great games on steam for the $10-$15 price range I don't get why someone would buy something incomplete when you could just get one of those instead.
 
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GazWorks said:
I disagree, steam is inundated with early access games, it's very easy to slap that label on your product and let it sit in development limbo all the while grabbing funds from people. Publishers and devs listen to the money not the people so if you see gamers chomping at the bit for unfinished products what kind of message does that send? Easy pickings and an exploitable trend. That's not to mention things like game burn out, the fact the product might not see the light of day at all and the fact that they are charging people for something that they pay actual testers to test.

Of course that's not to say all Early Access games are bad, Starbound for example is very good, but it's one of the very few that is nestled among things like 7 Days To Die which when it popped up as Early Access had a broken stealth system that was practically required to play the game successfully. There are LOADS of great games on steam for the $10-$15 price range I don't get why someone would buy something incomplete when you could just get one of those instead.
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Once again: If you don't like that model, don't purchase games on that model. I don't normally pay extra for beta or alpha access, but if it's a game that I am really passionate for I will be willing to spend a little extra on it to try it out a bit sooner. I often subscribe to betas of games simply to test them out to decide if I will like them or not. That way I can make an informed decision on the game.

Don't confuse design choices with work in progress though. Some things like your 7 days to die is clearly still a WIP and shouldn't be a decider on whether you buy the final game or not. However in my case I played the beta for Diablo 3 and it convinced me that I would not be able to enjoy myself in game due to the latency. This wasn't a work in progress item, it was something that wasn't going to change. Similarly I tried the elder scrolls online and I was disappointed because it wasn't nearly elder scrollsy enough, and way too much standard run-of-the-mill MMO. This isn't going to change in two or three weeks, so I'll give that a skip as well.
 
I couldn't have said it better myself, GazWorks. Too many indie developers are using Early Access to fund hobby projects that they're not dedicated enough to work on regularly. Early Access is inundated with titles that have made no significant progress in ages.

Just look at the games that actually do finish on Early Access. They're all being developed by teams who are either AAA or were part of AAA development in the past. This week Betrayer released out of Early Access, and the development team behind it is comprised of ex-Monolith employees. How many games on Early Access are still ages away from completion?

Towns is already an Early Access game where the developer just randomly stopped development, said he was 'burned out' and then declared the game finished. I suspect this will happen to the majority of Early Access games, because there's nobody looking at whether the developers are actually competent enough to finish the games they put up there.
 
Wyzak said:
Once again: If you don't like that model, don't purchase games on that model.
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The model itself is the problem and the rapid absorption into gaming culture isn't good for anyone whether I choose to buy it or not. It creates a trend in the industry.

Wyzak said:
Don't confuse design choices with work in progress though. Some things like your 7 days to die is clearly still a WIP and shouldn't be a decider on whether you buy the final game or not..
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If something is that broken even while in developent why charge $15 for it? Why not just work on it more and release it as a completed title. Obviously they want/need money, nothing against that. Charging people the cost of a full indie game for something you know isn't even at a level that's properly playable because of a missing or underdeveloped system is the real problem. What's more, that tiny block of blue they are afforded in steam is VERY rarely a true reflection of the current state of the game since it's controlled by the devs themselves.

Now I don't know about the 7 Days to Die devs, but there are plenty of shady folks out there who won't give a damn about the status of their game once they have a persons cash and to give that to them freely based on the hopes, aspirations and glorified tech demos should not be okay.
 
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GazWorks said:
The model itself is the problem and the rapid absorption into gaming culture isn't good for anyone whether I choose to buy it or not. It creates a trend in the industry.
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I can appreciate that comment, I feel similarly towards the always-online and free-to-play trends of gaming.

GazWorks said:
If something is that broken even while in developent why charge $15 for it? Why not just work on it more and release it as a completed title. Obviously they want/need money, nothing against that. Charging people the cost of a full indie game for something you know isn't even at a level that's properly playable because of a missing or underdeveloped system is the real problem. What's more, that tiny block of blue they are afforded in steam is VERY rarely a true reflection of the current state of the game since it's controlled by the devs themselves.

Now I don't know about the 7 Days to Die devs, but there are plenty of shady folks out there who won't give a damn about the status of their game once they have a persons cash and to give that to them freely based on the hopes, aspirations and glorified tech demos should not be okay.
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The companies who develop these games normally aren't really companies. Most of them are working on their first projects and people have taken years out of their normal careers to try something. These people still have bills to pay and families to feed. I can understand that indie studios sometimes need to rely on this funding model for their games, and I don't normally have a problem with it as long as they stick to their guns and deliver a final product equal to what they promised.

As with most of things in live, if you really want to make a difference they have to feel it in their pockets.
 
GazWorks said:
The model itself is the problem and the rapid absorption into gaming culture isn't good for anyone whether I choose to buy it or not. It creates a trend in the industry.
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I happen to like the model. Are you saying because you don't like it no one else should have access to this sort of model?
 
Game looks great and although I get its early in dev, Next Car Game looks better at this point in time. So much so, that I ignored my early access rule and bought it. Its very playable and loads of fun!

Still, if Carmageddon is half as fun as the 1st, I'll get it upon release.
 
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