Why we pay top $ for games.

Not much further to be said from my side.
If prices are too high, then don't buy and wait for prices to drop. Don't simply buy on impulse or 'you simply must have it'.

I still see people buying games and they admit it is too high and then the game isn't even worth it (see: FEAR2)
Obviously the price wasn't high ENOUGH if you went ahead and bought it anyway.

*shrug*
 
Biggest problem I have is that the problem is blamed on piracy. That's total crap. Game sales are going up, not down. Not to say I agree with pirated games, necessarily, but that's the wrong reason.

The real reason is no one wants to buy your terrible games for a terrible price. A brilliant, well priced game will sell loads.
 
lilDeath said:
Not much further to be said from my side.
If prices are too high, then don't buy and wait for prices to drop. Don't simply buy on impulse or 'you simply must have it'.

I still see people buying games and they admit it is too high and then the game isn't even worth it (see: FEAR2)
Obviously the price wasn't high ENOUGH if you went ahead and bought it anyway.

*shrug*
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well the guy who wrote the review for FEAR2 is a mate of mine and he usually gets games a week before or that week it comes out and he tells me whether or not its worth the buy and then I get it when the price drops on Take2
 
Tarvos said:
Biggest problem I have is that the problem is blamed on piracy.
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But perhaps the biggest concern over companies blaming piracy is that companies invest in anti-piracy tools. Lets face the facts, securom and safedisc and star force will have a "per dvd cost" and that adds up quickly. And they don't work, games are cracked within hours of being available [sometimes before it's available]. At R1 [for example] per DVD for protection, that means a game with 100 000 sold has lost out on R100 000... but I doubt that it's on sales figures and more than likely how many are produced. And I'd think that per DVD it's prob $1 for protection.

Over R1million for DVD protection that doesn't work?
 
sycogrim said:
well the guy who wrote the review for FEAR2 is a mate of mine and he usually gets games a week before or that week it comes out and he tells me whether or not its worth the buy and then I get it when the price drops on Take2
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That is very sensible, basing your decisions on what your buddy decides is good or not.
Shame the pressure the poor guy must be under when reviewing a game, knowing that it impacts directly on you! :D

Plus, this is exactly why there are game reviewers. They give opinions on a game, but it is still the individual's choice to buy the game or not.
I bet there are guys that buy a game regardless of what a review said.

This is in addition to also deciding when to buy, i.e. buying at a premium price or simply waiting for the price to drop or not buy at all.
 
The Joker said:
The only way pricing will drop for all platforms is if we, the gamers, the drones, stop feeding our gaming addiction
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I disagree.

Current situation: people pirate games thus forcing game devs and publishers to drive up prices in order to compensate for losses. Also, lack of remuneration means less money is put into game development, resulting in sub-standard games.

Ideal situation: people stop stealing from the devs/publishers and actually pay money for their games. Said devs/publishers can now not only afford to sell games at lower prices, but to make the games far better with the increased funding.

It pisses me off when I see people jacking all the latest titles from their mates at LAN parties, especially when they bitch and moan that half of their haul is crap. I fork out for PS3 games and will continue to do so when the console inevitably gets chipped, because (IMHO) if everyone did the same we'd be playing far more "MGS4's" and far fewer "Lair's."
 
Ok if you say so!!
Piracy is not to blame for the insane prices we pay for games.
Yes im against piracy but not everyone can afford to spend R1000 on a game!!
Gaming companies charge those insane prices cause they know we'll just keep buying.
There is no law telling them how much to charge for a title so they charge whatever they like!!

Its because of people like you and me and I dare say most of the proper gamers out there that game prices will keep clmbing because we'll keep buyng at the insane prices. Our morals get in the way of pure logic, so we spend R1000 on a game to make ourselves feel better.

"The rich keep getting richer"
 
The Joker said:
Gaming companies charge those insane prices cause they know we'll just keep buying.
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But what happens when people decide to pirate instead of pay those insane prices? Gaming companies lose money and drive up prices even more, and thus the vicious circle is perpetuated.

If there was no option to pirate, then I would agree with your argument: gamers would have no choice but to pay whatever the developers charge. However, the cheapskates among us are forcing the hand of gaming companies and making things worse for everyone else.

My hope is that the increasing console sales will slowly kill off the PC gaming platform and bring about some law and order to the piracy world. When developers then no longer HAVE to charge high prices for games, they'll have no justification in doing so, and thus prices should come down.

At the moment it's really just a case of a few ruining it for the many: most people can't see beyond their own gain and enjoyment and are just ruining the gaming industry for the rest of us.
 
RustPuppet said:
But what happens when people decide to pirate instead of pay those insane prices? Gaming companies lose money and drive up prices even more, and thus the vicious circle is perpetuated.

If there was no option to pirate, then I would agree with your argument: gamers would have no choice but to pay whatever the developers charge. However, the cheapskates among us are forcing the hand of gaming companies and making things worse for everyone else.

My hope is that the increasing console sales will slowly kill off the PC gaming platform and bring about some law and order to the piracy world. When developers then no longer HAVE to charge high prices for games, they'll have no justification in doing so, and thus prices should come down.

At the moment it's really just a case of a few ruining it for the many: most people can't see beyond their own gain and enjoyment and are just ruining the gaming industry for the rest of us.
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You really think if PC gaming disappears piracy will disappear? You are greatly mistaken. PS 2 games are pirated as much as pc games, there are already method to pirate xbox 360 games you just need to know where to look and how to do it properly. The only system safe so far is ps3. If pc gaming disappear the pirates will just concentrate on consoles.
 
Whoa, I'm not placing all the blame on PC users dude. My point is that the vast majority of piracy happens on the PC platform whereas the console side is easier to control.

Killing off PC gaming won't solve the problem but unfortunately it might end up helping the situation.

Read this:

PC piracy is a "huge concern", Command & Conquer: Red Alert 3 producer David Silverman has warned.

Speaking to VideoGamer.com in an interview to be published later this week, Silverman, who also works as a presenter for C&C TV, said that a "different approach" that includes digital distribution and micro-transactions will help tackle piracy on the PC in the future.

He said: "In all honesty piracy is a huge concern. Luckily people haven't figured out an easy way to pirate on consoles, otherwise you'd be telling me, 'oh, the console market's dying!'. It's a big problem and it's hard because you've got people like Greg (Black, lead balance designer) and a lot of guys on the development team who have been spending countless hours and someone just goes to download on a torrent site and they get the game. It's an unfortunate likelihood and it's one of the penalties that broadband came out. But unlike the music industry which went about it in an interesting way, we're trying some new things and I think we'll be productive in the years to come."

PC piracy is one of the industry's current hot topics. Recently Lionhead boss told VideoGamer.com that the PC gamer market was in "tatters". LucasArts explained to us in an interview from earlier in the year that it wasn't doing a PC version of Star Wars: The Force Unleashed because of the vast differences in power of PCs in people's homes and the lack of scalability of the game.

And Ubisoft Shanghai creative director Michael de Plater has told VG247 that a PC version of EndWar would most likely be shipping alongside the console SKUs if it wasn't for rampant PC piracy, and that copyright theft is essentially destroying the PC games market.
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sauce

Also:

Infinity Ward's community manager muses, "they wonder why people don't make PC games any more."

"We pulled some disturbing numbers this past week about the amount of PC players currently playing [Call of Duty 4] Multiplayer (which was fantastic)," writes Robert Bowling, on the game's community blog. "What wasn't fantastic was the percentage of those numbers who were playing on stolen copies of the game."

"The amount of people who pirate PC games is astounding," he added. "It blows me away that people are willing to steal games (or anything) simply because it's not physical or it's on the safety of the internet to do."

PC games sales have decreased in recent years due to rampant piracy of software and other digital goods over internet sharing sites.
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more sauce

Sad, but true :(
 
I would think piracy keeps prices lower. Piracy is like a competitor, albeit an illegal one, and competition means lower prices. If there was absolutely no piracy, the companies would be able to charge a price that is a balance between maximising units sold and maximising profits, which will more likely mean higher prices than we are seeing now. This is how the executives would see things, but personally, I believe most pirates were never going to be customers in the first place.
 
I see you only qoute western developers there. Here's the opinion of cd projeck and stardock. Piracy is an issue but its often used as a scapegoat for developers/publishers who produce poor games who wouldn't sell as much as they wanted to even if there wasn't piracy.

Developer Stardock Says Piracy Isn't Killing PC Gaming
Sins of a Solar Empire sells 200,000 copies.
by Jimmy Thang
March 11, 2008 - There have been a lot of recent talks about the decline of PC gaming. Development studios are closing down, and companies are analysing the woes of the industry. One publisher, however, thinks it na?ve to blame piracy for the decline of PC gaming sales. Stardock's latest, a space-based real-time strategy game called Sins of a Solar Empire, has sold roughly 200,000 copies since its release last month. So how has Stardock achieved success?

According to Brad Wardell, president and CEO of Stardock, (via the Sins of a Solar Empire forum) piracy is an issue, but he doesn't think it should be used as a scapegoat when a game doesn't sell. Wardwell states that there is a problem with the way that game developers currently look at the PC install base. "When you develop for a market, you don't go by the user base. You go by the potential customer base. That's what most software companies do. They base what they want to create on the size of the market they're developing for. But not PC game developers. PC game developers seem to focus more on the 'cool' factor. What game can they make that will get them glory with the game magazines and gaming websites and hard core gamers? These days, it seems like game developers want to be like rock stars more than businessmen," Wardell wrote.

Rather than trying to craft a game to get the most media coverage, Wardell approaches the situation from a financial point of view. "When I make a game, I focus on making games that I think will be the most profitable… when it comes time to make a game, I don't have a hard time thinking of a game I'd like to play. The hard part is coming up with a game that we can actually make that will be profitable. And that means looking at the market as a business not about trying to be 'cool'."

Following this approach, Wardell cites Sins of a Solar Empire's success. The game has received great critical praise, in addition to having sold nearly 200,000 copies in its first month; an amazing feat for a comparatively small budgeted title. Wardell cites the lack of copy protection on Sins of a Solar Empire as one of the myth busters to piracy killing PC gaming.

Wardell then points out the fact that not catering to the media has potentially taken away precious front page coverage from his game, but at the end of the day it's mostly trivial. "We still don't get the editorial buzz that some of the big name titles do because our genre isn't considered as 'cool' as other genres. Imagine what our sales would be if our games had gotten game magazine covers and just massive editorial coverage like some of the big name games get. I don't want to suggest we get treated poorly by game magazine and web sites, not just because I fear them, which I do; we got good preview coverage on Sins, just not the same level as one of the 'mega' titles would get. Hard-core gamers have different tastes in games than the mainstream PC gaming market of game buyers. Remember Rollercoaster Tycoon? Heck, how much buzz does The Sims get in terms of editorial when compared to its popularity. Those things just aren't that cool to the hard core gaming crowd that everything seems geared toward despite the fact that they're not the ones buying most of the games."

Developer Stardock Says Piracy Isn't Killing PC Gaming
by Jimmy Thang
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He attributes his games' success to three reasons. The first and central reason is to make a good game. However he does point out the fact that not all good games sell. Secondly, he cites the importance of making your game work on a wide range of PCs. Thirdly, Stardock targets the most cost effective genres with the largest customer base. Wardell also says his company doesn't cater towards the Chinese market, which is mostly dominated by software pirates.

Going back to the scalability of the game, Wardell asserts that users with high-end gaming rigs are few and far between, and it would be dangerous to focus so narrowly on that market. "I think people would be shocked to find out how few hard core gamers there really are out there… In other software markets, getting 1% of the target market is considered good. If you need to sell 500,000 of your game to break even and your game requires Pixel Shader 3 to not look like crap or play like crap, do you really think that there are 50 MILLION PC users with Pixel Shader 3 capable machines who a) play games and b) will actually buy your game if a pirated version is available?"

The appeal of Sins of a Solar Empire is that works on a wide range of computers, while maintaining more than suitable graphics. "Anyone who's looked at the graphics in Sins of a Solar Empire would, I think, agree that the graphics are pretty phenomenal (particularly space battles). But could they be even fancier? Sure. But only if we degraded the gaming experience for the largest chunk of people who buy games.

In closing, Wardell makes it known that he doesn't trivialize piracy, because he thinks it is a problem within the industry. To live with that fact, he just ignores the pirates and caters his games to paying customers. "The reason why we don't put copy protection on our games isn't because we're nice guys. We do it because the people who actually buy games don't like to mess with it. Our customers make the rules, not the pirates."

He went on to note, "In the end, the pirates hurt themselves. PC game developers will either slowly migrate to making games that cater to the people who buy PC games or they'll move to platforms where people are more inclined to buy games. In the meantime, if you want to make profitable PC games, I'd recommend focusing more effort on satisfying the people willing to spend money on your product and less effort on making what others perceive as hot. But then again, I don't romanticize PC game development. I just want to play cool games and make a profit on games that I work on."
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The CD Projekt interview

Progressive About Piracy


By Kris Graft
February 10, 2009
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See also:
CD Projekt
DRM
Piracy
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"Of course we can’t totally forget that piracy exists. But, well, it already does, so why not be progressive in the way you try to actually encourage sales of legal games?"


Last year, CD Projekt, the same company behind the PC role-playing game The Witcher, announced a unique initiative that seemed as much a PC fan's pet project as a legitimate business venture: Good Old Games.

Good Old Games, or "GOG," which is currently in beta, is a digital distribution and community site that offers classic PC games (Fallout, Painkiller, Messiah, et al) that are compatible with Windows Vista and XP, under $10 and, perhaps most notably, DRM-free. Since GOG's July 2008 announcement, CD Projekt has been working to sign more deals with publishers, but there has been some resistance from companies wary of GOG's staunch "no-DRM" stance.

This week, Edge spoke with CD Projekt's PR and marketing VP Tom Ohle to catch up on the latest developments at GOG, as the community and digital distribution site continues its beta phase.

Why aren't you worried that people will just pirate these no-DRM games? Or are you worried?

Of course we can’t totally forget that piracy exists. But, well, it already does, so why not be progressive in the way you try to actually encourage sales of legal games? I can go on a wide variety of sites and search for a classic game that I want, and I can find it--with the CD check removed or a crack that circumvents copy protection. So these games are practically DRM-free anyway. Now if you’re a gamer and want to play one of these games, but can’t find it in stores or don’t want to pay crazy prices on eBay, your only option is to get an illegal copy. Gamers (most of them) don’t want to do that and feel a bit guilty about it, publishers don’t make any money, and the piracy issue becomes more prevalent. We just want to give people legitimate copies of these classic games without putting any hurdles in their way.

That being said, the lack of DRM is still our biggest hurdle to getting publishers to sign on [for GOG]. We’re having fewer issues with getting companies on board now that the site has shown some sustained success, but we really want to get every possible game up at GOG.com; that means that we still need major publishers to sign on. It’s a great deal for them, as they can start making good money from their out-of-print games, and it’s great for gamers who can find working copies of old games they love without having to lower themselves to piracy.

How is developer and publisher interest in GOG? Has it grown much since launch; is it meeting, maybe surpassing expectations?

We’re really happy with the fact that we’ve been able to maintain a really solid release schedule since going into beta, adding two or three games each week. Those games have come from a steady flow of new publishers and developers that want to bring their games to the site, and I think we’re starting to build some momentum on that front. Originally we had to do a lot of the legwork ourselves to get new deals, but it’s started to snowball a bit and now we have a lot of companies coming directly to us. Some of the deals we’re working on right now – which should close in the next few weeks or months – should help to further increase our credibility, and will hopefully encourage some more major publishers to monetize their back catalogs at GOG.com.

What's next for GOG besides expanding the library?

Expanding the library. Oh. You already said that. We’re doing a lot of work behind the scenes to extend the site’s functionality and features, like more robust user profiles, better integration with things like our Twitter feed and YouTube channel, and some more GOG-generated content like our editorials. We want to make the site even more appealing for people who are just looking for a great community of people interested in classic games. One of our highest priorities is trying to expand the audience – encouraging people to tell their friends about the site. If you’ve got any ideas on that, I’d love to hear them. [Laughs] Just kidding… sort of. We have a lot of ideas, but since we’re relying heavily on word of mouth, we want to give fans a reason to spread the word.

What happens if places like Steam start selling more old cheap games, encroaching on GOG's territory? Is that a concern?

They’ve already started doing that--these Steam weekend deals are pretty good, you know. ... We’re still really confident in our business model and the unique value we offer, so we’re not too concerned about others making moves into classic games. Gamers want a hassle-free experience and great value–we’ll always be pushing DRM-free games that work on modern operating systems, are cheap and packed with bonus materials. It’s a hard deal to beat.
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