Diablo 3 Beta - Feedback :}

[Dragonic]

Did you have someone who is Lvl 11 in you game while you where lvl 4, would you mind explaining a bit more? If nothing else you will level fast. Just remember you dont have to play with other people, unless you open your game to the public and only people in your friendlist cant jump into your game.

I also wanna know what he means by that.

 

[Blazzok]

Another post I want to share with you guys, which I found interesting. I'll just post the info here, instead of the link, since the info is somewhere in the thread, and not at the top.

The post compares the number of skills for a Barbarian in D2 to that of a Barbarian in D3 as they gain levels. This once again showcases the customization in D3 as well as the increase in player choice.

If you want to read yourself, it is the bottom most post in this thread:
http://d3db.com/blue/thread/4662477428/us

"Diablo 2 Barbarian skill progression

Level 1:
Bash
Howl
Find Potion

Level 6:
Leap
Double Swing
Taunt
Shout

Level 12:
Stun
Double Throw
Find Item

Level 18:
Leap Attack
Concentrate
Battle Cry

Level 24:
Frenzy
Battle Orders
Grim Ward

Level 30:
Whirlwind
Berserk
War Cry
Battle Command

=========================

Diablo 3 Barbarian skill progression

1 Bash
2 Hammer of the Ancients
3 Cleave
4 Ground Stomp
5 Rend
6 Bash Clobber Rune
7 Hammer of the Ancients Rolling Thunder Rune
8 Leap
9 Ancient Spear
9 Cleave Rupture Rune
-
11 Frenzy
11 Rend Ravage Rune
12 Seismic Slam
12 Ground Stomp Deafening Crash Rune
13 Revenge
13 Bash Onslaught Rune
14 Weapon Throw
14 Leap Iron Impact Rune
15 Hammer of the Ancients Smash Rune
15 Ancient Spear Grappling Hooks Rune
16 Sprint
17 Threatening Shout
17 Frenzy Sidearm Rune
18 Cleave Reaping Swing Rune
18 Ground Stomp Wrenching Smash Rune
18 Seismic Slam Stagger Rune
19 Earthquake
19 Rend Blood Lust Rune
19 Revenge Vengeance is Mine Rune
20 Whirlwind
21 Furious Charge
21 Leap Launch Rune
21 Weapon Throw Mighty Throw Rune
22 Battle Rage
22 Ignore Pain
22 Frenzy Triumph Rune
23 Ancient Spear Skirmish Rune
23 Sprint Rush Rune
23 Threatening Shout Intimidate Rune
24 Earthquake Giant's Stride Rune
24 Whirlwind Dust Devils Rune
25 Call of the Ancients
25 Seismic Slam Shattered Ground Rune
25 Revenge Best Server Cold Rune
25 Weapon Throw Richochet Rune
26 Overpower
26 Bash Punish Rune
26 Battle Rage Marauder's Rage Rune
26 Ignore Pain Bravado Rune
27 Hammer of the Ancients The Devil's Anvil Rune
27 Furious Charge Battering Ram Rune
28 War Cry
28 Ground Stomp Trembling Stomp Rune
28 Threatening Shout Falter Rune
29 Sprint Run Like the Wind Rune
29 Earthquake Chilling Earth Rune
29 Whirlwind Hurricane Rune
29 Overpower Storm of Steel Rune
30 Wrath of the Berserker

31+ Another 72 assorted runes

===

A Diablo 2 Barbarian will finish Normal difficulty with 20 different skills to choose from.

A Diablo 3 Barbarian will finish Normal difficulty (level 30, per Bashiok's confirmation) with 59 (FIFTY-NINE) different skills to choose from. He will continue gaining skills after level 30 all the way up to level 60 at the rate of about 2 new runes to try per level, for another 72 (SEVENTY-TWO) skills left to be earned by the end of Normal, or a total of 131 different skills to select by the time he's just about to start Inferno difficulty."

 

[OmegaFenix]

A Diablo 2 Barbarian will finish Normal difficulty with 20 different skills to choose from.

A Diablo 3 Barbarian will finish Normal difficulty (level 30, per Bashiok's confirmation) with 59 (FIFTY-NINE) different skills to choose from. He will continue gaining skills after level 30 all the way up to level 60 at the rate of about 2 new runes to try per level, for another 72 (SEVENTY-TWO) skills left to be earned by the end of Normal, or a total of 131 different skills to select by the time he's just about to start Inferno difficulty."

Also in D2 is you made a poor choice by the time you got to normal you where screwed. In D3 you are free to mix and match, swap in and out to your harts content until you find the Skill and Skill Rune combination that works for you.

Nice post dude.

 

[Phatso]

Also in D2 is you made a poor choice by the time you got to normal you where screwed. In D3 you are free to mix and match, swap in and out to your harts content until you find the Skill and Skill Rune combination that works for you.

Nice post dude.

Yep, thats why D3 is better in that way, you don't need to worry about 1 misclick of skill or stat allocation and you can play around till you find your groove. Its funny, I got torn apart on another SA gaming discussion board (*cough*egamer*cough*) for saying the exact same thing..

 

[OmegaFenix]

Yep, thats why D3 is better in that way, you don't need to worry about 1 misclick of skill or stat allocation and you can play around till you find your groove. Its funny, I got torn apart on another SA gaming discussion board (*cough*egamer*cough*) for saying the exact same thing..

Lol. There is still a huge divide between the old style (Dumping points into a locked system) and the newer style (Open systems like D3 or Amalur) where you can easily respec your character. I think as more games use open systems this trend will change, I also think its part of the hardcore vs casual BS going around. I always find it ironic that gaming is one of the fastest moving entertainment mediums (tech wise) yet alot of gamers get stuck with antiquated mechanics and are sometimes outright opposed to change.

 

[simon]

yet alot of gamers get stuck with antiquated mechanics and are sometimes outright opposed to change.

I actually blame games being too good for that one. Diablo 2 was a classic and people really loved it. 15 odd years later people have so much hype around D3 that they are scared any changes won't measure up to their childhood or whatever memories of D2.
So yeah I reckon the more games that implement the new systems the more this will start changing. <imo^

 

[OmegaFenix]

I actually blame games being too good for that one. Diablo 2 was a classic and people really loved it. 15 odd years later people have so much hype around D3 that they are scared any changes won't measure up to their childhood or whatever memories of D2.
So yeah I reckon the more games that implement the new systems the more this will start changing. <imo^

Nostalgia makes you stupid IMO.

 

[SnowWar]

I find its usually either the hardcore elitist jerks or the people who jump on that bandwagon (without actually being part of the crowd who played on that level) who moans about things changing.

These EJ ppl want the gap between the normal players and hardcore to be just that big. But in D2 that just meant spending an insane amount of time doing the same gear runs and hoping for runes to craft or using bots. It was time and not skill related for the most part.



Do you guys even remember D2 pre patch 1.12 you could not respect. So if you dropped a few points in the wrong skill you where screwed and could not do Hell. GG roll a new toon & google more.
It was kind of annoying to level and have to save the skill points just so you could stack them in the 1 or 2 skills at the end of the tree.
So what did that mean? You get a spell near the start of the game that did X amount of dmg and you could not really improve it because you needed to save those points for a spell you will only get much much later in the game...
And even if you did drop points in there it was pretty much useless later in the game.

Read the awesome link Blazzok posted - http://us.battle.net/d3/en/forum/top...1455085?page=1

It really does explain allot and that from a perspective of a hardcore D2 player. Its well said and I can relate to it from experience.
They really did not just remove things, they changed and evolved things for the better.

Its true as a society we don't really like change, especially when we have fond memories of something. But one also needs to remember if you don't learn from mistakes and strive to improve you will be left behind.

 

[simon]

Nostalgia makes you stupid IMO.

yeah pretty much. Its why lately I have been trying to take a different approach to games. Rather looking at games that change things from their sequels fairly drastically (Heroes VI, Arcania etc) and looking at them as entirely different ip's with similar stories/characters etc. Then judging them on their own merits. Rather then oh its a shit game coz it doesn't have what number 1 did. Evil developer F%%ked up my game! just wish more people would try that approach instead of being whiny bitches lol

 

[OmegaFenix]

yeah pretty much. Its why lately I have been trying to take a different approach to games. Rather looking at games that change things from their sequels fairly drastically (Heroes VI, Arcania etc) and looking at them as entirely different ip's with similar stories/characters etc. Then judging them on their own merits. Rather then oh its a shit game coz it doesn't have what number 1 did. Evil developer F%%ked up my game! just wish more people would try that approach instead of being whiny bitches lol

As a Designer I am forced to look at games differently, which is probably why my opinions are sometimes so way out. Also why I some times ask a question to which I already know the answer, to see how people respond.

 

[Isengard]

Seeing as how I never really played any Diablo games (only clones) I have zero opinion on the matter, but I'm always game for change, stagnant gameplay puts me off quite a bit.

 

[ZenbaaS]

The new skills allocation is great. It's gonna make playing so much more fun and characters will also so end up feeling much more powerful as your skills level with you. The nice thing about the system is that even my SO played the beta with me and picked up a lot of the things herself without me saying a word.

 

[OmegaFenix]

The nice thing about the system is that even my SO played the beta with me and picked up a lot of the things herself without me saying a word.

While I too love the fact that D3's systems are so easy to pick up and play it is also the thing some of these " hardcore" players are griping about.

When I have to come up with game concepts or mechanics for my design course I try and make them as accessible as possible, sometimes this is easier than others but Bliz did a great job of making it accessible and still appealing to more core gamers.

 

[fayainz]

but Bliz did a great job of making it accessible and still appealing to more core gamers.

I agree, and I think in order to stay competitive in this industry you have to make your game as accessible as possible.
WoW is a good example of an extremely accessible game, if my girlfriend can manage it anyone can

On a side note: I find it is increasingly more difficult to keep a gamers attention, gone are the days of trial and error of solving a puzzle, or combining items into a useful tool that helps you progress past a point in a game, I think this is largely due to being spoilt for choice, along with games progressively becoming more linear by design (and what I mean by that is you are guided/hand-held the entire time). I know so many people who get a game, play it for maybe 2 hours and don't come back to it. Just look at the ever increasing number of people who do not finish games, that is not because the games are difficult by any means, in fact I think games have become easier over time.

 

[weakest_link]

easier or just boring

 

[OmegaFenix]

I agree, and I think in order to stay competitive in this industry you have to make your game as accessible as possible.
WoW is a good example of an extremely accessible game, if my girlfriend can manage it anyone can

On a side note: I find it is increasingly more difficult to keep a gamers attention, gone are the days of trial and error of solving a puzzle, or combining items into a useful tool that helps you progress past a point in a game, I think this is largely due to being spoilt for choice, along with games progressively becoming more linear by design (and what I mean by that is you are guided/hand-held the entire time). I know so many people who get a game, play it for maybe 2 hours and don't come back to it. Just look at the ever increasing number of people who do not finish games, that is not because the games are difficult by any means, in fact I think games have become easier over time.

I think its purely because we are spoilt for choice. At any given time, even the dry spell leading up the Christmas release landslide, most of us have several titles fighting for our attention. Because we are so spoilt if something fails to maintain our attention it is simply & quickly replaced by something else. Yes games have become easier because that is the easiest (and the worst) way to make something appear accessible.

I think what we should also remember is we do live in a time where the is just so much vying for our attention (intern, films, games, facebook, twitter) and information move so fast that alot of people dont have time to finish that title that has been lying in front of their console for the last six month. I myself am guilty of this; I get maybe 1 or 2 hours of gaming in a night if I am lucky, with studies, wife, project work all consuming my time. Gone are my days of spending 4 - 5 hours a night after work in a game and clocking 3 or 4 games a month. Dark Souls, Kingdom's of Amalur, Rage are all lying in front of my console half played, SWTOR, D2, SC2 all on my Mac barely started. And its not because they are not any good or I dont enjoy them (except Rage) I simply dont have time to play or something newer, better, shinier has my attention (Currently Witcher 2 & Soon D3).

 

[SnowWar]

@OmegaFenix well said!

Being an older gamer having fond memories of Atari and then PC games like Doom, Xcom, Diablo etc. I really do agree with what you have said above

 

[fayainz]

I think its purely because we are spoilt for choice. At any given time, even the dry spell leading up the Christmas release landslide, most of us have several titles fighting for our attention. Because we are so spoilt if something fails to maintain our attention it is simply & quickly replaced by something else. Yes games have become easier because that is the easiest (and the worst) way to make something appear accessible.

I think what we should also remember is we do live in a time where the is just so much vying for our attention (intern, films, games, facebook, twitter) and information move so fast that alot of people dont have time to finish that title that has been lying in front of their console for the last six month. I myself am guilty of this; I get maybe 1 or 2 hours of gaming in a night if I am lucky, with studies, wife, project work all consuming my time. Gone are my days of spending 4 - 5 hours a night after work in a game and clocking 3 or 4 games a month. Dark Souls, Kingdom's of Amalur, Rage are all lying in front of my console half played, SWTOR, D2, SC2 all on my Mac barely started. And its not because they are not any good or I dont enjoy them (except Rage) I simply dont have time to play or something newer, better, shinier has my attention (Currently Witcher 2 & Soon D3).

Exactly the same boat I'm in. So many games, so little time. I've found myself making game choices based on how much time they require, recently playing Journey on PSN and I enjoy Starcraft 2 online because the games are 30min long at the most. I have a huge backlog that I just cba to finish. I tend to play a few games at the same time but often due to time constraints if I lose interest, the game gets lost in the great backlog. I would love to do another playthrough of Mass Effect 3 but I really just don't get the time to do it. Weekends are the only time I can sit back and enjoy gaming because I have a ton of time. I generally leave games like The Witcher 2 to the weekends.

EDIT: More on topic I highly doubt D3 will disinterest me, and I'll probably squeeze extra time to devote to it

 

[OmegaFenix]

Exactly the same boat I'm in. So many games, so little time. I've found myself making game choices based on how much time they require, recently playing Journey on PSN and I enjoy Starcraft 2 online because the games are 30min long at the most. I have a huge backlog that I just cba to finish. I tend to play a few games at the same time but often due to time constraints if I lose interest, the game gets lost in the great backlog. I would love to do another playthrough of Mass Effect 3 but I really just don't get the time to do it. Weekends are the only time I can sit back and enjoy gaming because I have a ton of time. I generally leave games like The Witcher 2 to the weekends.

EDIT: More on topic I highly doubt D3 will disinterest me, and I'll probably squeeze extra time to devote to it

I also leave weekend open and then binge on a my current game. I've tried not getting games until I have time to play them, a tactic that has failed miserably, damn you awesome gaming trailers/hype.

Yeah, D3 will probably push quiet a few titles onto my backlog.

 

[SnowWar]

One thing I know is that if there are not urgent work I am not coming in from the 15th to the 18th. Ow so nice to be in a position of power